Nathan Cardinal
A photo of three people in a red canoe. This is Nahatlatch Lake, in the traditional territory of the Nlaka’pamux Nation, west of Boston Bar, British Columbia where Nathan spent many years exploring and learning about land stewardship. Photo Credit: Nathan Cardinal.
Nathan is Métis with roots in northern Alberta. Currently, he works as the senior advisor on Indigenous Relations with the Nature Conservancy of Canada where he is on secondment from Parks Canada. Nathan has spent much of his time thinking about how individuals and organizations can support the rights and responsibilities of Indigenous People in conserving and stewarding their traditional territories.
We sat down with Nathan to explore his journey through various connections and collaborations with Indigenous communities to help them achieve their vision for land stewardship and conservation.
Nathan discusses the importance of providing support to Indigenous nations pursuing Indigenous Protected and Conserved Areas (IPCAs), his diverse experiences within the conservation sector to date, and how the various learning circles and knowledge streams hosted by the Conservation through Reconciliation Partnership (CRP) have facilitated his work and connected him with others.
He shares with us how he’s enjoyed engaging in and sparking important conversations that are informing and guiding environmental organizations, such as the Nature Conservancy of Canada.
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Full Transcript
Introduction: Kristy Tomkinson
Hello, kwe’, boozhoo, taanishi, oki, atelihai , čačim hihak kʷaa, bonjour and welcome to Community Connections – a collection of stories from the Conservation through Reconciliation Partnership. These stories will explore the relationships at the core of our work to support and elevate Indigenous-led conservation across what is now known as Canada.
My name is Kristy Tomkinson and I will be your conversation guide.
In this episode, I am speaking with Nathan Cardinal.
Nathan is Métis with roots in northern Alberta. Currently, he works as the senior advisor on Indigenous Relations with the Nature Conservancy of Canada (NCC) where he is on secondment from Parks Canada.
He is a member of several circles and work streams of the Conservation through Reconciliation Partnership, including the Land Trust Sharing Circle, the Domestic Law and Policy Stream, the Conservation Governance Stream, and the Knowledge Systems Stream.
So, make yourself some tea, get comfortable, and join us.
Kristy Tomkinson
OK. So again, thanks Nathan. For joining us for this Community Connections conversation. I'd like to begin with asking you to briefly introduce yourself.
Nathan Cardinal
So, my name is Nathan Cardinal. I'm Métis. My family comes from northern Alberta and southwestern NWT; though these days I live on the traditional territory of the W̱SÁNEĆ and Hul’q’umi’num people down in in what's known, excuse me, what's now known as southwestern BC
And I work for the Nature Conservancy of Canada as a Senior Advisor on Indigenous Relations, which is, I mean, like all titles, are largely made up, but this one maybe more so than others. But my role really is just to help the organization and improving how it builds meaningful relationships with Indigenous nations and communities and how it supports Indigenous-led conservation kind of wherever it operates.
Kristy Tomkinson
And so, how did you come to this work and what has that journey looked like for you?
Nathan Cardinal
It's interesting. I was thinking about that the other day. Like, I never set out to work in this kind of intersection between conservation and Indigenous rights and responsibilities, but kind of when I look back at my, my interests, my experiences, my academic training it all kind of really kind of was or has been about that. And it kind of led me to where I am today and talking to you guys.
My family is kind of a long line of people from working on the land and connecting with the land. My dad as well, too, grew up hunting and trapping and fishing and that kind of thing and he's a prospecting geologist by trade.
And so, when I was a kid, I basically spent pretty much every summer out in the bush with my dad looking around for gold and other kinds of minerals and stuff like that. And I didn't, I didn't realize, I think at the time, how impactful that was for me.
And when I went to school, started in university, it was like, "oh, I’m just going to be an engineer or computer scientist" and kind of enrolled in those kind of things and I always remember sitting in a lab one day and I’d been in the computer lab for like three hours and going to be there for like another three at least.
And it was a beautiful fall day, and I was looking out the window and I thought "I can't do this. I can't sit here for three more hours. How am I going to do this for the rest of my life?". And that was a real opening revelation for me and kind of helped to reorient my path anyways to this kind of work and have really over the years just been, continued to be, connected with Indigenous communities and their leadership and their efforts to you know, accomplish their own conservation visions.
So whether that's been working with nations along the Fraser watershed around looking at fisheries, whether that's been connecting with hunters and trappers and others to think about how they relate to species and species at risk and how can federal government kind of think about that and engage in that in kind of a "two-eyed seeing" approach; to working with Parks Canada and thinking about parks and protected areas and how that supports Indigenous leadership and restoration projects to Indigenous Guardians programs to Pathway to Canada 1.
All along that journey has been opportunities to kind of think about these types of issues, opportunities, initiatives across a wide variety of geographies and I think what has been driving me consistently is how do I, in my role, in my work, support organizations in doing better when it comes to collaborating and supporting Indigenous leadership?
And really, ensuring that that work is centered on the land and is centered on building meaningful relationships with nations and communities, right? From Elders and youth and working on the land together, to working with chief and councils, Elders groups, to elected leadership, to national representation organizations; that it all is centered upon the land and conservation, and how do we support those voices and those perspectives?
And so that's kind of what's led me here today.
That's kind of a little indirect kind of answer, I guess to what you're asking. But that's what drives me. And I look at this work as obligations and responsibilities hold as a modern interpretation of what my ancestors have done in terms of their kind of connections and managing their responsibilities to the land.
Kristy Tomkinson
Well, that's really interesting. Thanks for sharing that.
Could you, could you then tell us how you got involved or come to know with the conservation through reconciliation partnership?
Nathan Cardinal
Sure, so I think I met, I met Robin years ago at some earlier conferences, again looking at kind of that intersection between Indigenous Knowledge and conservation and actually a few of the folks that are working with the CRP as well.
And then I had a chance to kind of reconnect with Robin and others through some of the work with, the early early work around the Pathway to Canada 1 and the, some of the early sort of IPCA conversations too, and that's where I first heard about the CRP partnership.
And so, I was working with Parks Canada at the time, and Parks Canada was looking to kind of kind of further advance its ability to kind of support that work, and so we're an early partner in that and I was kind of talking about that with Robin.
And so, when I came to NCC a couple years ago, I definitely found out that NCC was also an early partner in that and was able to kind of make those connections back to Robin and others to see how can NCC kind of be engaged in this work?
I think the, one of my common mantras and this kind of stuff is that no one person or one organization can do this alone. And for organizations like NCC that are just starting on this journey, there's so many sorts of gaps in resources, ability, knowledge, understanding that we really need to work in quite in close crowd or collaboration with others.
And so, to look to the way the CRP has been established as a really really great entry point to start thinking about all those questions that we've been asking internally and really kind of connecting with researchers and other experts and Indigenous communities, knowledge holders, to start listening and learning and being able to kind of answer the questions that we've been, the organization's been asking itself for a while. So, I really have appreciated the structure of the CRP.
I really respect who's been engaged and the approach it's been taking and the way it's kind of centered on Indigenous learnings and knowledge and governance systems. That, I think that's a good model of going forward and saw that as a real opportunity for learning for NCC as an organization.
Kristy Tomkinson
And I know that you're involved in a lot of various Learning Circles and Work Streams. Could you tell us more about your involvement in those areas?
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, sure, so I feel like I get involved in a lot of those, those different streams with the CRP just 'cause there's so much. I think where there's lots of overlap, lots of opportunity, lots of ability to kind of network and learn and share and listen, and again kind of effectively work on all these things. That kind of cross these different streams and braid each other together.
So, I’ve worked quite closely on a couple kind of like "subgroups" I guess? Like one is working I think working with CRP and Parks Canada and others to think about cultural approaches to fire management, and how can we support kind of resurgence of that across fire management in Canada?
Work quite closely with the Indigenous Land Trust Circle to think about Indigenous land trusts and then through the sort of the participate in some of the Domestic Law and Policy Streams, some of the Indigenous Knowledge Streams as well as some of the Governance Streams as well too. And I think we’re also getting involved, well, hopefully kind of connecting with some of the conservation finance work in the Conservation Finance Stream too.
I just think that there's such a broad range of stuff to kind of learn from that a lot of it really fits quite well with where NCC is trying to head and learn from, so we kind of get involved in a lot of stuff.
Kristy Tomkinson
So, could we, could we focus on, perhaps, a relationship with someone or an organization that you've developed or strengthened through your engagement with the CRP, could you share your story about that?
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, you bet. I think one of the most obvious ones for me and for maybe for NCC too, has been kind of the recent work we've done through the both kind of like domestic law and policy and kind of the Indigenous Land Trust Circle Streams where there's been stuff, and it's just, NCC has been like "We need help. We need support.".
We just want to know a lot of these kind of things when we think about consultation or engagement and Indigenous rights or thinking about Indigenous Land Trusts, and how can we, what can NCC do to kind of support those kind of concepts or opportunities?
And so, in both of those streams, really, I had the opportunity to kind of have worked quite closely with Larry Innes and Ian Attridge on and in both of those kinds of spheres of work. And through working closely with them and connecting with folks like Trish Nash and Megan Pagniello and Clint Jacobs, Aimée Craft, and quite a number of other people has really really helped us, I think, in asking some really fundamental questions for the organization.
And so thinking about the Indigenous Land Trust Circle, being able to bring, actually, a whole bunch of questions to the group and work with Ian and Trish to kind of flesh those out to the point now that we're able to work with the CRP and the university of Guelph to actually hire an Indigenous Land Trust Fellow to actually do research on these questions that were kind of born out of the Indigenous Land Trust over the next years, it's been amazing.
And the work that we've been able to do support the CRP, and Ian and Larry and kind of coming through domestic policy, that really, I think, shone a light, has shone a light on private land conservation and Indigenous rights that there really hasn't been much scholarship there before.
And the opportunity to kind of ask those questions, have them do that detailed work has been really, really relevant for NCC and I think relevant for the private land conservation movement more broadly. And how does it start to think about concepts like land, the land, back movement? How does it build effective relationships? What are best practices out there?
Have been amazing, amazing opportunities and I think really has helped ask us and answer some really foundational questions. So, I think both like working with Larry and Ian specifically and then both with the domestic law and policy and Indigenous Land Trust Circle have been really great and amazing connections for me and for NCC.
Kristy Tomkinson
So yeah, you speak about these connections you've been able to make. I'm curious to know, have you had opportunities to support others or connect others within this work and in what ways?
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, yeah, we have, which has been really interesting too. I think the more opportunities that have kind of come up as well.
So NCC, kind of, you know, we, we've been working to establish meaningful relationships and work on different sort of conservation projects with different nations and communities across Canada.
And whether that's been, you know, I think we've been kind of connecting a bit with groups like the métis nation of Alberta for instance, some nations in BC, and they're oftentimes asking questions about conservation finance, or they're asking questions about Indigenous land trusts; and being able to kind of make those connections to the CRP have been really, really informative to help kind of build and grow those circles.
So those have been, kind of, I think, really interesting opportunities to kind of connect through, to bridge, those kinds of worlds together and opportunities together from the work that we've been doing and kind of connecting them more broadly.
Whether that's been thinking about relationships with the Ktunaxa and the work that the Ktunaxa are doing and how that could be supported by the CRP or groups like the Métis Nation of Alberta or groups like the Kabaowek First Nations, Aki Sibi Institute have been really, I think, informative, and vice versa, the opportunity to kind of meet folks like Megan and Trish through the CRP and be able to follow up with them and think about how is there an opportunity for NCC and staff and the sort of the region of Unama'ki to be able to support their work as well too and kind of making those connections. Those have all been, I think, really positive networks and webs that have been created through our opportunities to participate with the work that CRP is doing.
Kristy Tomkinson
Thank you.
What are some connections you'd like to make with individuals or organizations but just haven't had a chance to and why would you like to make those connections?
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, I think it's been, you know, I’ve appreciated the opportunity to kind of connect and learn from like folks like Larry McDermott and hear from a few others as part of the Elders Lodge. It would be nice to be able to kind of connect a little bit more with them and hear a little bit more about their thoughts with regards to the CRP and the different streams. I think I would really appreciate more of that.
We connect a lot with different, sort of, the operational and technical folks from communities and the leaders from different communities, but it would be a really great opportunity to hear from, kind of, some of the Elders and others in those communities. We would really like more of that opportunity.
And I think the other one I’ve been thinking about too is the opportunity to kind of connect with crown governments, and is there a way to do more of that? I think that, again, we're doing a lot of great work to kind of connect nations and Indigenous organizations and nonprofits and sort of the conservation world and academics are doing really good work, but I think to advance that change that's needed governments are also a part of that.
So, is there a way to kind of connect with governments? And you know, I’ve worked with Parks Canada as well, and the opportunity for organizations like Parks Canada or Environment Climate Change Canada to participate and hear and learn from the dialogue and discussion I think would also really help to shape their own path and process as well too, and to be able to do that collectively would be really really great.
So, I think those are a couple voices that it'd be really nice to be able to, kind of, connect more with.
Kristy Tomkinson
And speaking of the Elders’ Lodge; as you may know, they have shared with us the seven grandmother-grandfather teachings. I'm sure you know them all. I'm wondering, we like to ask this question: which of those sacred gifts have been most present for you in your relationship building and in your connections?
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, I was going through them this morning and when I was thinking about, it's like it's really hard to have one of those teachings without another. So, when I think about truth, it's hard to have truth without bravery; or it's hard to be, have humility without honesty.
And so, I was thinking about that a bit, and I think the one that, in my mind, kind of connects them all is kind of love. Like and I think about love as being the connector across people. So, it's you know how do we kind of love and respect each other and how do we also, I think Larry always talks too about kind of love of the land and how do we center that on what we do? To be able to, from which everything else kind of follows. So, in my mind love I think is really kind of a central component there.
If I think specifically about some of the work that NCC has been doing with say, the Indigenous Land Trust Circle, or kind of the work to explore Indigenous rights and private land conservation, I think that some of the ones that kind of come most prevalent there for me are the aspects of the teachings of honesty and humility because I think for a lot of private land conservation organizations there's been an ability to kind of ignore Indigenous rights and responsibilities for a long period of time.
But if we are honest about ourselves with ourselves there, that isn't right and that isn't possible. And to be able to recognize that private land conservation has really benefited from the persecution of Indigenous people. And how do we, how do we recognize that? How do we tell that truth?
And how do we approach that with humility to make sure that we're kind of moving forward in a good way? And how do we recenter and relearn and reorient ourselves to focus on new ways of conservation and prosperity and community wellbeing? So, I think that being honest about ourselves and having humility is really important to empowering those organizations to think differently about, well, conservation.
So, while I think love is the connector in these specific situations, I think honesty and humility is have been really important teachings for us.
Kristy Tomkinson
Thank you. I like that idea of having that love being the main connector of all the all the teachings.
Nathan Cardinal
I always think of it like it's like the Lord of the rings, like what's the one ring that binds them all?
Kristy Tomkinson
I like that. That’s great. That's a good way of thinking of it.
And so that was my final question, but unless you have any other thoughts or like final reflections, you'd like to add in terms of relationship building and connections within our larger family of the partnership.
Nathan Cardinal
Yeah, I think, you know, I really would just want to thank the CRP and hold my hands up to the integrity that the organization holds. And I think it’s had such a great focus on the importance of relationships, the importance of respect to I think oftentimes recenter the conversation, especially whether it's from, you know, the colonial systems of conservation or academia that can contribute or facilitate the disrespectful relationships.
So, the work that the CRP has done to kind of, to think about that space and the opportunity it can have to engage more broadly and think differently have been really really important, even just as an example for how we can do things differently and the ability kind of the web of connections that it promotes, have been a great model for taking the time to build those relationships and ask important questions that need to be asked. And again, because we all need help and not one of us has the answer, that we all have to do this collectively. And being able to work as a collective has been amazing.
So, I take every chance I can get to connect with the CRP and the members and those relationships because those relationships will transcend probably the ultimate endpoint of the CRP at some point and to be able to foster that in a really positive way will help hold those obligations and responsibilities that organizations and individuals carry forward for this work in the future in a really good way.
So, I just really thank the CRP for allowing and creating that space.
Kristy Tomkinson
Thank you so much Nathan.
Mahsi and thank you Nathan for sharing you story with us today.
That concludes this week’s story on Community Connections. New episodes will be released biweekly and you can find all episodes on our website at www.conservation-reconciliation.ca.
We would like to extend our gratitude to all of our community members who have made this series possible, including Heather Patterson, Allison Bishop, and our guest contributors. The music for this series is called Moonrise and is produced by Reed Mathis.
If you are enjoying this series and are interested in sharing your stories of connection, please email us at crpinfo@uoguelph.ca
Thank you and tune in next time to Community Connections.